Tsipras and his Syriza Party came to power on an anti-establishment platform, which also included criticizing the EU’s stance towards Russia. Showing that he walks the walk just as much as he talks the talk, the Greek Prime Minister carried through on his pledge to try to restore relations between Brussels and Moscow.
Tsipras and Putin agreed that relations between their two countries were very important and special, and Russia suggested that Greece could purchase gas from the Turkish Stream, potentially even becoming a major revenue-generating hub that could also connect to Italy and the Balkans. The Russian President also said that the potential fruits of future cooperative projects could be used to help Athens repay its massive debt.
Andrew Korybko: So let us come to our first section, beyond the headlines. Let’s speak about the Greek prime minister having visited Moscow. Tsipras and it’s Syriza Party came to power in an anti-establishment platform, which also included criticizing the EU stands towards Russia. The Greek Prime Minister cared through in its play to try to restore relations between Brussels and Moscow. Where the debate who obsessed the media speculating never materialized, important progress was still made in Greek-Russian relations. Tsipras and Putin agreed that relations between their two countries were very important and special and Russia suggested the Greece can purchase gas from the Turkish Stream, potentially even becoming a potential revenue generating hub that could also connect to Italy and the Balkans. The Russian president that the potential fruits of future cooperative projects could be used to help Athens to pay its massive debt.
Sergei Strokan: I think that obviously all eyes are focused on the Prime Minister Tsipras visit to Moscow closely watched all over Europe and that’s quite understandable, because much was on stake, not only for bilateral relations between Russia and Greece but also for the whole European policy of sanctions. You were absolutely right to mention those agreements or understandings which were reached on the bilateral cooperation in gas and trade, including how to bypass the Embargo on the sales of Turkish fruits to Russia. But I think the most important think is not even that we see a sudden upgrade in the foreign trade. But we have seen entirely different atmospheres. I’ve spoken to Kommersant’s special correspondent Andrew Koreleslikov who was in the Kremlin and who was watching two leaders and he told me that the most striking thing was the atmosphere. We haven’t seen that frostiest smiles, we have not seen the tension that was prevailing in the relations between Russia and Europe all over the last months. So we’ve seen two leaders who are willing to work out and implement, translating to reality positive agenda. And this is something fundamental, so probably, one year after the sanction policy was imposed, we see an event which can come as a game change in the whole relationship between Russia and the EU.
Korybko: When you mention a game change, I’ll like to address this issue to our in-studio guest Mr. Kyrill Koktysh, an associate professor at the Moscow State Institute of International Relations. In terms of Mr. Tsipras visit to Moscow, how accurate it would be to call this a strategic pivot for either side?
Kyrill Koktysh, Associate Professor, Institute of International Relations, Russia's Foreign Ministry (studio guest): Actually, a strategic breakthrough because actually it changes the balance on who leads Europe. And Greece got the chances to became a main broker towards the rest of the Eurozone so that means that the biggest country tends to be one of the most powerful country controlling the key issues for resources of the European Union. So this really changes the rule of the game.
Strokan: What I said is not only restricted to trade and economic ties, but what is important is also psychological, trust, confidence. We’ve seen an erosion of confidence so now it seems that we’ll get to reverse the process, fingers crossed, of the erosion of confidence.
Koktysh: It’s a fundamental change because Greece starts its own game bargaining the Greek debt, bargaining the other hard issues. And now Greece got strong resources from Russia and the Russian support.
Strokan: It’s important for Greece not to be treated as a second grade country. Prestige is very important for Greeks. We have a guest now, her name is Anna Lyatsu, she is a Greek independent researcher and author based in Moscow. Anna, how would you comment on the atmosphere now ever since Tsipras and Putin meeting. How do you think it helps to alleviate Greek prestige in Europe?
Anna Liatsou independent researcher and author: I have to say that I had an opportunity to be with the delegation during the last three days and what surprised me is that Mr. Tsipras, the Greek Prime Minister, mentioned several times that the situation and the way the things were happening in Europe actually possess a huge threat to Greek’s tolerance and Greece does not have the opportunity to act as an independent country. But now, the Greek government is trying to turn, to change this situation somehow, and they say that the relations with Russia are good relations could contribute to that aim. I agree with that idea of what happened during the last three days could become a very crucial thing not only for Greece but for the whole Europe. And I think that this has to be treated in connection with the fact that the Greek Crisis is not a Greek Crisis as it is, but it is a European Crisis and it has to be solved all together by all European countries. Another thing that I heard is that the Greek Prime Minister mentioned a number of times that the European crisis, that the only way to solve, to resolve the European crisis is to work together with Russia, a huge neighbor, and to try to build communications and partnership with Russia. What I think is important is that Tsipras mentioned that Greece has become the strategic partner for Russia and that Russia will continue being a partner for Greece. Let’s see how this will be treated in Europe. This is definitely a big question, how Berlin and Brussels will treat Tsipras visit to Putin. They are already many media reports about that and I think that the next two weeks will show the future of the situation in EU/Russia relations.
Strokan: I have a question on the economic ties: When can we see and expect all those delicious Greek products to come to the shelves of our shops? I’m asking just as a consumer!
Liatsou: You know, yesterday I had a conversation with the Greek Energy Minister and he told me that in the project of the construction of the Pipeline in Greece, they were planning to sign this memorandum in the next days and when I asked him about the sanctions he answered me that he doesn’t think that the sanctions will be long-term sanctions. According to their opinion, would finish within the running year. The idea is them to be finishing pretty soon. I also had the opportunity to talk to an analyst and Greek professor and he told me that there are countries against which there are sanctions for up to sixty years but Russia is definitely not the case.
Korybko: Right now we are inviting to our program to Athina Korlira, editor in chief for the foreign language program of radio The City of Athens – Athina 98.4. We are wondering what is the atmosphere like in Greece now where we were discussing the atmosphere here in Russia after the Tsipras-Putin’s summit and we wanted to know what are the Greeks saying, and what’s the mood in Athens right now?
Athina Korlira, Editor in chief, Foreign language program, the Radio of the City of Athens "Athina 984": Actually I wanted to say that there’s been a big fear over this trip of Mr. Tsipras to Moscow without immediate economic benefits for the country, although the government tries to play the card that the Greeks and the Russians have discussed the prospects of investments which, off course they did, however issues such as Russia helping Greece by founding now that we are in a very serious crisis was not something on the agenda of the talks.
Strokan: Well, the other talk of the day was how Greece today is performing this balance between Moscow and Brussels. You know that this new government came to power on the strength of that anti Brussels establishment pledge, so what other relations with EU Bureaucracy are? How do you see that?
Korlira: First of all, there has been concern from European Officials of this visit and how Greece will deal with keeping its European profile while meeting the possible next candidate for supporting Greece financially, which is Russia. However, from the experience of this three days visit of our Prime Minister to Moscow, would that repeat keep our European profile and we remained rather not very open about this talks going further and this type of cooperation due to the fact that anything that divides Europe is what we call the Unknown, so we have to do that we do know and what we can handle at this time and from then onwards we can off course have a relation. They discussed things that are really serious like the investment one energy pipeline or the Embargo on the imports shortage that is something that will help the economy of Greece. I think that Russia has an interesting investing force and other infrastructural charges on the country, possibly taking over the trains and investing in tourism. So there is optimism in that sphere. I think that anything that was discussed with Russia will not be revealed as this or will not be considered anytime before the summer.
Korybko: Right now we have our final guest joining us, who is Mr. Guillaume Bigot, managing director of IPAG which is a French business school. We were wondering if this increases Greece’s position in negotiating a debt with the EU. Does Greece potentially have more options that can use with talking with Brussels?
Guillaume Bigot, managing director of IPAG (French Business School): Yes, indubitably. Because I think now the people says that the Greek government was under the pressure of EU and IMF, but this visit reveals quite the opposite. I think the Greek government knows that the issue is out of Euro as a single currency, but they don’t want this option to be created by then, they want the EU suggesting it, and is probably the first step for them to do this, so it’s a way to put the pressure indubitably on the EU institutions and the IMF, the TROIKA as they put it.
Korybko: I just have another question. Considering the process that has been made, what would be your forecast for when Tsipras returns to Moscow to celebrate the 70th anniversary of the World War Two Victory? Yet no economic agreements were signed with Moscow, but what’s for forecast for Tsipras next visit to Moscow? They’ll make more progress on economical agreements or potentially more effort on the pipeline we were discussing?
Bigot: Not only pipeline, I think that Mr. Tsipras and Mr. Putin know that behind economic lines there are definitely political lines. One has to remember than a dollar in United Stated is much more debted than in Greece. The reason than why United States is not going to pay its debts first, is that the US is powerful and is able to concentrate a political and military strength. I think now the Greek government knows that, as I told you before, the Euro exit is the only option for them. And they want also to prepare the economic links either you are talking about the pipeline or agricultural aid for Greece now. Maybe even facilities from Russia in Greece, so the future of Greece as well as the future of Bulgaria or Romania is already the case of Serbia: are closer relations with Russia.
